Amiga Tools 3/Amiga Tools 3.iso/grafik/raytracing/imagine/tips/arc19.txt

Text File | 1993-03-12 | 112KB | 2,857 lines

IMAGINE archive: collected off of [e-mail]

ARCHIVE XIX
Jan. 21 '92 - Feb. 6 '92

If you have questions or problems with this file, email Marvin Landis
at [e-mail]

note: each message seperated by a '##'

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##

Subject: Major bug in 2.0
Date: Tue, 21 Jan 92 13:16:15 EST
From: [e-mail] (Rob Borsari)

That bug has been fixed.  I don't have a version number for the fix here,  I'm
fairly sure that Impluse is upgrading by mail.  I don't have details so call
them.  If you need more info write me and I will check on it.  BTW
the bug I am talking about is crashes when traceing a scene with transparency
and two light sources or curved objects.
  New biznezz -- Does anyone have a working version of the INT version of the
bugfixed 2.0?  My 030 version runs fine but the INT version crashes with a
00000003.garbage.  -R-
[e-mail]   Rob Borsari   "Bourne to be Wild"

##

Subject: Re: 2.0 docs
Date: Tue, 21 Jan 92 15:46:45 EST
From: Mark Thompson <[e-mail]>

[This message is over a week old but I am running behind]

Mike.G.Wilson writes:
> Speaking of which, BUY Imagemaster!!! It's indispensable. I have a Toaster
> and since Toasterpaint is the most useless programme ever written, I needed
> a 24 bit paint programme. Imagemaster is that, and so much more.

How do you use this program with the Toaster? I didn't think there was any
program out there not produced by NewTek that took advantage of the Toaster
frame buffers. If it doesn't use the Toaster, how are you doing 24bit
paint? I REALLY badly want a real 24bit paint program!

> I do love Imagine (it crushes Lightwave, although we will see how
> Lightwave2.0 stacks up)

Crushes???....(BLECH...BELCH...BRAP!), I'd sooner saw my legs off with
a rusty butter knife than have to create animations with Imagine.
Seriously, you are entitled to your own opinion. But as someone who
does production animation, I feel LightWave is much better at getting a
job done. Each program has its strengths, but ease of use and predictability
are not Imagine's. I find it appauling that after being on this list a year,
there are people (bright people who have been on this list for some time)
that are still having problems with very basic 3D operations (like simple
texturing). Even with bad documentation, a 3D program should not take that
much time and effort. As for rendering quality, LightWave is capable of
some truly amazing stuff. Email me if you need proof.

On a related note to product comparisons...after reading the MacWorld
article on 3D packages for the Mac, I whipped up my own version of the test
scene they used. It took the better part of an evening to do all the
modeling, texturing, and scene layout for an image that looks as good as
or better than anything in MacWorld (I'll post it to hubcap shortly).
I urge someone to do the same with Imagine (make it look really good)
and submit it to Impulse and/or one of the Amiga rags (or even to MacWorld
for laughs). It just might sway a few otherwise potential Mac-based
3D buyers (especially when you consider the cost differential).
|~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~|
|      `       '        Mark Thompson                 CONCURRENT COMPUTER  |
| --==* RADIANT *==--   [e-mail]        Principal Graphics   |
|      ' Image `        ...!uunet!masscomp!mark       Hardware Architect   |
|     Productions       [phone] [phone]   & General Nuisance   |
|                                                                          |
 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

##

Subject: TTDDD & TTDDDLIB survey... Your reply is greatly appreciated!
Date: Tue, 21 Jan 92 16:38:23 PST
From: [e-mail] (Glenn M. Lewis ~)

    Hello, Imagineers!

    I would like to enhance TTDDD and TTDDDLIB and would like your
input on what should be done.  If you would please reply to this message
directly to me, I would very much appreciate it!  Thanks!

    In the following questions, I will lump TTDDD and TTDDDLIB
together and call it "TTDDD" for simplicity...

----------------------------------------------------------------------

1) What would make TTDDD more worthy of a Shareware contribution?


2) What would make TTDDD worthy of being a commercial product?


3) How could TTDDD be more useful?


4) What aspects of object creation within Imagine could be better
   performed algorithmically?


5) What is missing in TTDDD that you would like to see?


----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Thanks again for your time in filling out the above survey!  I
very much appreciate it!

                        -- Glenn Lewis

---
Glenn Lewis | [e-mail] | These are my own opinions... not Intel's

##

Subject: Morphing Grouped Objects
Date:    Wed, 22 Jan 92 11:22 EST
From: "Marc Rifkin" <[e-mail]>

You can morph attributes and scales of grouped objects- but
you can't morph their rotations (gives an error) or relative positions
(does not happen). Why??
The Cycle editor only helps out with rotations.

Marc Rifkin
Integrative Technologies Lab, Penn State University
5F Mitchell Building, University Park, PA 16802
814-863-8062 or for you normal people, [e-mail]
"Say, that's a nice bike."

##

Subject: Morphing groups
Date: Wed, 22 Jan 92 14:13:36 EST
From: [e-mail]

. You can morph attributes and scales of grouped objects- but you can't
. morph their rotations (gives an error) or relative positions (does not
. happen). Why??  The Cycle editor only helps out with rotations.

. Marc Rifkin


That's right. Morphing does -NOT- work with grouped objects. If you
want to change the positions of objects in a group, you should use the
Cycle editor. This is *exactly* what it is designed for.

The Cycle editor will perform much more than simple rotations: you can
move, rotate, and scale each object, though you might want to use null
links if you don't want to keep the objects connected. Any relative
positioning of objects can be done just by manipulating the links. You
can also set up the poses in the Detail editor if you don't want to
use the funky Cycle commands like Twist.

You can also morph two cycles to make the individual objects change
shape. You can even morph the Cycle motion! Im my book, I describe how
to use this to make a horse smoothly and seamlessly change from a walk
to a gallop to full stop.

-----

Summary: Morphing groups really doesn't work at all. This is really the
domain of the Cycle editor.

-Steve

---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Steve Worley                                        [e-mail]
---------------------------------------------------------------------------

##

Subject: Interesting rumor
Date: Wed, 22 Jan 92 17:09:39 EST
From: [e-mail]

In the latest Amazing Computing, there is a small mention that Imagine
(along with some other programs) will be able to use the DMI resolver
for its interface. The mention was only one line long, so I have absolutely
no details, but it's an interesting fact to think about.

The DMI Resolver board is a 1280 by 1024 8 bit display board.... can
you see yourself modelling on a screen with over twice the resolution
(4 times as many pixels!) as you are now? Bliss...

This fact was just mentioned in passing in the description about
the latest Amiga show in Canada.

-Steve

---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Steve Worley                                        [e-mail]
---------------------------------------------------------------------------

##

Subject: Parallel sunlight rays.
Date: Wed, 22 Jan 1992 12:27:20 EST
From: [e-mail] (P.W. Gousios )

You could make an object that is  a plane, and make it a lit object, as I have
heard can be done, now though I have not tried lighted objects yet.

The plane should be large enough to cover the area of interest, and can be
placed above it without being very far away.

Pete Gousios
[e-mail]

##

Subject: Re: 2.0 docs
Date: Thu, 23 Jan 1992 13:20:15 GMT
From: [e-mail] (Stephen Menzies)

Mark Thompson <[e-mail]> writes:

>[stuff deleted]
>Crushes???....(BLECH...BELCH...BRAP!), I'd sooner saw my legs off with
>a rusty butter knife than have to create animations with Imagine.
>Seriously, you are entitled to your own opinion. But as someone who
>does production animation, I feel LightWave is much better at getting a
>job done. Each program has its strengths, but ease of use and predictability
>are not Imagine's. I find it appauling that after being on this list a year,
[stuff deleted]

>|~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~|
>|      `       '        Mark Thompson                 CONCURRENT COMPUTER  |
>| --==* RADIANT *==--   [e-mail]        Principal Graphics   |
>|      ' Image `        ...!uunet!masscomp!mark       Hardware Architect   |
>|     Productions       [phone] [phone]   & General Nuisance   |
>|                                                                          |
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
No question in my mind that LW's production animation capabilities surpass
Imagine's. Rendering seems to be clean and predictable. Attributes, maps etc
are simple to apply. But my observation is that the modeller is archaic even
to those who were dedicated M3D users. LW just isn't the be all, end all in
animation production. This may even explain the slew of "phonebook"
renderings that we have seen over the past year. Most that I see, that are
are using LW in production, are using an alternative modeller and Imagine
is among those used. Ofcourse Impulse doesn't want to recogize this, or
atleast they haven't made it any easier by supporting the LW object
format (like Caligari2 does) but then again maybe they really believe
that their software is the most powerfull in the world and is worth more
than those that cost "hundreds of thousands of dollars more" (AW ad)...
..duh ..we're stupid , right:)

stephen
--
Stephen Menzies
#Internet: [e-mail]
#Fidonet : Stephen Menzies @ 1:167/265

##

Subject: Re: 2.0 docs
Date: Thu, 23 Jan 92 10:27:53 EST
From: Mark Thompson <[e-mail]>

Stephen Menzies writes:
> No question in my mind that LW's production animation capabilities surpass
> Imagine's. But my observation is that the modeller is archaic even
> to those who were dedicated M3D users.

Definately. That is why I can't wait to get my hands on the 2.0 Modeller
which has been greatly enhanced. But even 2.0 (what I know of it) is still
missing some key features like spline curve primitives. We will see when
it comes out.

> Most that I see, that are are using LW in production, are using an
> alternative modeller and Imagine is among those used.

Imagine is definately a more powerful modeler. I must confess however that
there are few instances where I have trouble creating what I need with
LightWave's Modeler (probably because I have grown used to working around
its limitations....and 1.05 doesn't hurt either).

> Impulse hasn't made it any easier by supporting the LW object
> format (like Caligari2 does) but then again maybe they really believe
> that their software is the most powerfull in the world and is worth more
> than those that cost "hundreds of thousands of dollars more"

Well Impulse doesn't hold a monopoly on the high and mighty attitude. NewTek
reciprocated by supporting a variety of object import formats and did
not include Imagine, nor does it save to any format other than LightWave.
|~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~|
|      `       '        Mark Thompson                 CONCURRENT COMPUTER  |
| --==* RADIANT *==--   [e-mail]        Principal Graphics   |
|      ' Image `        ...!uunet!masscomp!mark       Hardware Architect   |
|     Productions       [phone] [phone]   & General Nuisance   |
|                                                                          |
 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

##

Subject: Imagine anim format animation
Date: Thu, 23 Jan 92 09:38:47 MST
From: [e-mail] (Brian Ridout)

Hi all!

I have a couple of questions.

1) I have made an animation which I rendered in lores interlace using the iff format
not the imagine format.  When I made the animation and displayed it using showanim
the animation paused then played and the last frame or so of the loop had bad colors.
I made the animation using buildanim off of hubcap and display it using showanim it pauses
but the last frame is fine.  I use view to display it and everything is fine.
So, the first question is What did I do wrong when making the anim using imagine2.0?
Second, Is there a better way?  What is accepted for making animations to distribute?

2) This animation I made is my first animation I have made which I think is good.  It is
a P51 flying through a circular canyon from the viewpoint of a chase plane.  Imagine 2.0
made this simple to do because brushes are so much easer to handle.
So, this question is:  Does anyone want to see it?  It is over 2Meg so I don't want to just
dump it in an incoming directory somewhere if people think this sort of thing is boring.
Also the object of the P51 is from the object disk in Imagine 2.0 so is there any problem
distributing pictures made from it?

Thanks

Brian Ridout

##

Subject: Brush Mapping! HELP!
Date:    Thu, 23 Jan 92 16:35 EST
From: "'Bish' (Doug Bischoff) EMT-MAST" <[e-mail]>

     Okay: someone mentioned that brush mapping was so easy on Imagine, but
I still have what I think to be a relatively simple problem that nobody can
offer a solution to!!

     For example: I have a box.  Just a brown box.
                  I want to put, for example, a black logo on it that
                      says something like "HANDLE WITH CARE"
                  If I just wrap it right onto the side of the box after
                      creating it in DPaint III, I get "HANDLE WITH CARE" in
                      black with a white background on a brown box.
                  HOW DO I GET RID OF THE WHITE BACKGROUND??

     Thanks for any help: I have a MAJOR project to do that just CAN'T be done
without this!  Thanks again!

/---------------------------------------------------------------------\
| -Doug  Bischoff- |    *** ***    ====--\         | "Paramedics save |
| -DEB110 @ PSUVM- |   *  ***  *     ==|<>\___     |      LIVES       |
| -The Black Ring- |    *** ***        |______\    |      -but-       |
| --- "Wheels" --- |      ***           O   O      |  EMT's save the  |
| Corwyn Blakwolfe |     T.R.I.     -------------  |   Paramedics."   |
\---- [e-mail]  D.BISCHOFF on GEnie  THIRDMAN on PAN -----/

##

Subject: Brushmap backgrounds
Date: Thu, 23 Jan 92 18:32:34 EST
From: [e-mail]

.  If I just wrap it right onto the side of the box after
.                      creating it in DPaint III, I get "HANDLE WITH CARE" in
.                      black with a white background on a brown box.
.                  HOW DO I GET RID OF THE WHITE BACKGROUND??


Indeed, Imagine will map the WHOLE brush onto the object. The
workaround is pretty easy, though. Make the background of the brush
match the color of the box! If the colors match exactly , you can't
tell where the edges of the brush are.  Careful if you aren't using a
24 bit brush (odds are you're not!)  In Dpaint, note the RGB color of
the brown you're using as a background, then use these values times 16
as the 24 bit colors on the box itself.  Thus, a brush with a (10,4,2)
background color (only 0-15 range) means you should color your box
(160,64,32).

Note this also means you can't get full white (255 255 255), but only
15*16=(240 240 240). This is what the "Full Scale Value" parameter is
used for.

Have fun!

-Steve

---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Steve Worley                                        [e-mail]
---------------------------------------------------------------------------

##

Subject: Re: Brush Mapping! HELP!
Date: Thu, 23 Jan 92 19:38:53 -0500
From: [e-mail] (Michael B. Comet)

>
>     Okay: someone mentioned that brush mapping was so easy on Imagine, but
>I still have what I think to be a relatively simple problem that nobody can
>offer a solution to!!
>
>     For example: I have a box.  Just a brown box.
>                  I want to put, for example, a black logo on it that
>                      says something like "HANDLE WITH CARE"
>                  If I just wrap it right onto the side of the box after
>                      creating it in DPaint III, I get "HANDLE WITH CARE" in
>                      black with a white background on a brown box.
>                  HOW DO I GET RID OF THE WHITE BACKGROUND??
>
>     Thanks for any help: I have a MAJOR project to do that just CAN'T be done
>without this!  Thanks again!
>
> -Doug  Bischoff
>

    Okay, you have the hard part down, that is getting the brush to
actually appear correctly on the object.

    Now, what you need to do is to make note of the box color- ie:
where are the RGB sliders for the brown box.  Then go into DPaint and
write out Black letters on the Brown bkg which you should duplicate from
the brown in imagine.

    Granted, this is not the best way, as there may be small
differences, and tweaking them together can take time.

    I believe that the Genlock Brush (which I haven't gotten to
work) is supposed to take any color 0 part of the brush, and make it
invisible, (at least this was a feature I asked for, when I wrote
impulse, but it doesn't seem to function this way for me - or function
at all really).  But there is one more (slighty round-about) way to do
this and you won't have to worry about makeing the brown colors match.

    Add a primitive plane to be the label, or rather the Decal.  2
faces are fine for this.  Now, in DPaint, create your "Handle With Care"
in whatever color you want the color of the letters to be, and don't
worry about the BKG color.  Now, Save this brush.  Now, go into the
palette under Dpaint, and make the colors you used for the letters 0,0,0
that is BLACK, and the background a high white.  Save this picture
seperately for a filter map.

    (If you want Black letters, you can just make one pic of the
black letters, on a pure white background, just use the same pic for
both brush maps coming up)

    Now in imagine, wrap the normal colored brush with Flat X, Flat
Z, and color.  Imagine 2.0 Should place these correctly for you.
Anyways, before you click on okay, select TRANSFORMATION and then size,
write down the X,Y & Z sizes that are shown since you MUST duplicate
these EXACTLY for the next brush.

    Now, (assuming you hit cancel or okay in Trans. and OKAY'ed the
first brush) add the second brush - the one that is only black and white.        Make sure this is also FLAT X and
FLAT Y.  However, change its type to FILTER.  Now simply select
TRANSFORMATION, then SIZE, and enter the X,Y,Z values that were you used
for the first color brush.

    Now place this object on the box where you want it to appear.
What happens is, it first (so to speak) brush wraps the letters in color
with the colored background as normal.  Then however, using the B&W
brush, it eliminates any color that is pure white, that is, lighter
colors will become transparent and darker colors not.  So, you should
end up with a "Decal" of Brown letters, and that's it.

    You may need to change the FULL SCALE VALUE in the brush box of
the Filter brush to 240 due to the way DPaint uses colors, this should
make the "clear" part of the brush truly invisible.

    The first method is clearly the simplest and fastest if you do
not require that much accuracy, however, makeing a Decal can perhaps
create some more creative ideas, such as you could make a morph to make
the lebel actually "peel" off of the box and so forth.

    Hope this helps!

               Michael Comet
               [e-mail]

##

Subject: Suggestion for the mailing list
Date:     Thu, 23 Jan 92 13:13:17 +0100
From: Hannes Heckner <[e-mail]>

Hi Imagine freaks,

I've got a suggestion for the mailing list:

Steve Worley wrote that there are about 200 active members on the mailing list.
These members have probably all at least one amiga with Imagine. But they all
have the same problem. Generating scenes in trace mode in the highest
resolution does consum very much time. So I thought that someone who has
made a superb animation but not the cpu power to see his work running in
highest qualitiy could place his data files (objects,brush,stage data etc.)
into a special directory (what about imagine/projects). So anyone could
download this data and get some pictures generated.
(Before downloading you should write a small note into the directory mentioned above avoiding that 2 people generate the same pictures)
After he has generated the pictures he can upload the them into the directory.

Imagine that for example 30 members of the mailing list help calculating your
movies. They will get generated in an amazing speed.

The movie could be uploaded for public domain use.

I see that there is the problem of ftp upload/downloading because it is
expensive.
So I want you to write your opinion about my suggestion.

Hannes



P.S.: The members of the mailing list could participate at several computer
      graphic competitions with movies they generated.

##

Subject: Re: Brush Mapping! HELP!
Date: Thu, 23 Jan 92 18:56:39 PST
From: [e-mail]

In reference to how to use text as a brushmap without the background
showing through.

The way I do this is to first decide onthe color of the object. Then
go into D-Paint and set the background to the same color as the object.
Add you text, cut out the brush and save it. Now when you wrap it onto
an object all you will see is the object plus the text.

##

Subject: File Formats
Date: Thu, 23 Jan 92 21:28:28 PST
From: [e-mail] (Eric Chet)

Hello All

     Does anybody have a document or FTP site thay could email me
discribing the Imagine, and LightWave 3D file formats?

Thanks in advance

PS yyes please email me a FTP site :-) you know what I mean.

Eric
[e-mail]

~
/**************************************************************************
 * Eric Chet       | Amiga does it better
 * [e-mail] | Ray Tracing and other graphics techniques
 * BIX: chet       | "Use what is useful, simply to simplify"
 */

##

Subject: Suggestion for the mailing list (fwd)
Date: Fri, 24 Jan 92 8:28:33 CST
From: camelot![e-mail]

Forwarded message:
> From uucp Thu Jan 23 23:14 CST 1992
> From: Hannes Heckner <ingr![e-mail]>
> To: [e-mail]
> Subject: Suggestion for the mailing list
> Message-Id: <[e-mail]>
> Date:     Thu, 23 Jan 92 13:13:17 +0100
>
> Hi Imagine freaks,
>
> I've got a suggestion for the mailing list:
>
> Steve Worley wrote that there are about 200 active members on the mailing list.
> These members have probably all at least one amiga with Imagine. But they all
> have the same problem. Generating scenes in trace mode in the highest
> resolution does consum very much time. So I thought that someone who has
> made a superb animation but not the cpu power to see his work running in
> highest qualitiy could place his data files (objects,brush,stage data etc.)
> into a special directory (what about imagine/projects). So anyone could
> download this data and get some pictures generated.
> (Before downloading you should write a small note into the directory mentioned above avoiding that 2 people generate the same pictures)
> After he has generated the pictures he can upload the them into the directory.

    It's a good idea if the 30 people aren't using the machine for
    their own movie's.  The impressions I'm getting is that a lot of
    the machines are already being used.  Still... maybe I'm wrong.
    If so, then it would be a good idea.

    Alternate thoughts along the same vein.  Sounds like a good idea
    for a service company.  Someone with some $$$ to invest could
    process long movies for people with limited processing power.  I
    have often thought that it would be nice if Impulse had an
    exectuble that would work on a super computer.  That Imagine users
    could set up the animations on the amiga, send it to the "big
    guns", retrieve it and run it back on the Amiga.  I have no idea
    how much time on a super computer would cost so I am dreaming of
    course.  Perhaps it is unreasonable or unaccessable.  But it would
    be nice if there was a service provided to process Imagine files
    quickly.


>
> Imagine that for example 30 members of the mailing list help calculating your
> movies. They will get generated in an amazing speed.
>
> The movie could be uploaded for public domain use.
>
> I see that there is the problem of ftp upload/downloading because it is
> expensive.
> So I want you to write your opinion about my suggestion.
>
> Hannes
>
>
>
> P.S.: The members of the mailing list could participate at several computer
>       graphic competitions with movies they generated.
>
>
>


--

        ____________________________^__________________________________

        dale r. rogers               Email:  ingr!b24a!camelot!dale
        afme training                Internet:
                                     ingr!b24a!camelot![e-mail]

        INTERGRAPH CORPORATION       Phone
        HUNTSVILLE, AL 35894-0001    Direct: 205 730 8294 (Messages)
        MailStop: LR24A4             Fax: [phone]

                                    .

##

Subject: morphing
Date: Fri, 24 Jan 92 09:43:13 GMT-0500
From: Scott Matthew Krehbiel <[e-mail]>

Hi.
I don't know if this dilemna was ever resolved, ( morphing a skull
into a sphere ), but here's  a trick I did a while ago in good
ol
Videoscape.  I needed an anim of two phones, one morphing into the
other, but I had the same problem of the faces suddenly snapping
into place.  Here's my solution.
Create two anims, one with the morph running the way you'd want it
to work, and one running backwards.  In the middle of both anims,
you should have a rather wacky mess of polygons and cacti, and
rotorooters, and so on.  it's at that middle frame that I cut
between one animation and the other.  It'd be even better to fade
from one anim to the other, but you'd have to do the fade on the
individual frames with some paint program.  Anyway, you get the
picture.  start at each end with a clean object, and morph toward
the middle.  Also, if you can, fade at the middle.
I don't think that anyone would notice if one cactus suddenly
popped into another roto-rooter in the middle.

Just a thought.


Oh, and about that idea of having the sphere grow from inside the
skull,  do you think that's how they did some of the Terminator
effects - having the mercuric fluid shape of the body, and a
genlock object of about the same shape inside the shiny one?
when the genlock object grew, it would gradually block the
mercury one, and allow the video signal to come through, showing
the actor.  It would look like the mercury was receeding, going
into the actor.

just another thought.

Scott Krehbiel
[e-mail]

##

Subject: Re: File Formats
Date: Fri, 24 Jan 92 10:03:05 EST
From: [e-mail] (Carolyn Scheppner - CATS)

>      Does anybody have a document or FTP site thay could email me
> discribing the Imagine, and LightWave 3D file formats?


The Turbo Silver / Imagine object format (TDDD.doc) is in the
new IFF Manual which is in the back of the new Addison-Wesley
Amiga Rom Kernel Manual "Devices" volume.  The TDDD.doc is in
the sideways printed third party specs.


##

Subject: Re:  Suggestion for the mailing list (fwd)
Date: Fri, 24 Jan 92 08:48:08 MST
From: [e-mail] (Ben Scott)

Real "super"computer time can be quite expensive - the electricity bills
alone for a Cray run into 6-7 figures per MONTH.  This is not to say that
one couldn't gather up a batch of '040-equipped 3000s and get the job done.
But to make it truly a usable service, you couldn't rely on, for example,
the normal mail service.  You'd have to assure everyone has a Syquest or
something like it, and it'd take days each way to send... no, the only way
to do it would be through the Internet, either FTP or some kind of specail
mailserver arrangement (though the finished products might be considered
a bit large for mail purposes...).  Payment by credit card, possibly, and
you just send up your file, get it rendered, and ready for you in say a
day or less. i] It could work, with the proper influx of initial capital...
like so many other business propositions.

.                          <<<<Infinite K>>>>

--
.---------------------------------------------------------------------------.
|Ben Scott, professional goof-off and consultant at The Raster Image, Denver|
|Internet [e-mail], or call the Arvada 68K BBS at [phone].|
|-------------------------------------.-.-----------------------------------|
|"I hate to imprison a noble sentiment| |The Raster Image IS responsible for|
|in mere words, but.... bye!" - Larry | |everything I say!  ** Amiga Power**|
`-------------------------------------' `-----------------------------------'

##

Subject: Help creating a soccer ball
Date: Fri Jan 24 08:12:37 1992
From: [e-mail] (Victor Martinez)

Hi,
    I need to model a soccer ball, so I would like to know which
section should I start with? Detail Editor or Forms Editor.
Thanks
Victor Martinez

##

Subject: RE; Suggestion for mailing list.
Date: Fri, 24 Jan 1992 09:58:03 -0700
From: [e-mail] (Stacey Brewer)

Syquest or other removable media would be much quicker than the internet for
some projects.  The average project I work on runs at least 90 Megabytes,
and some have gone as high as 500 Mb. Using FedEx Next Day delivery would
make return of the projects reasonable, but Internet would tend to get
extremely bogged down with just a couple transfers of this size though your
node. Internet transfer of the initial project setup would be reasonable,
but unless you are only doing small anims, Land delivery might be a more
efficient(cheaper) consideration.

-Just my $0.02 worth-

Stace

##

Subject: Scale of objects
Date: Fri Jan 24 09:48:54 1992
From: [e-mail]

It seems that the scale of a object, is proportional to how well the
detail in an object renders.  If this is so, what would be the optimal
range of sizes? (pretty subjective question, huh?).  My question comes up
because I am attempting to render a fluted column.  The flutes tend to get
lost when the object is at a smaller scale, thus all I really get is bunch
of jagged lines.  Yet making an object too large has obvious disadvantages
which I discoved last weekend.  I'm ping-ponging back and forth with scaling,
please, does someone have some "guidelines"?  Thanks.

Scott Pack
<EndOfHeader>

##

Subject: Object scale
Date: Fri, 24 Jan 92 16:43:18 EST
From: [e-mail]

.It seems that the scale of a object, is proportional to how well the
.detail in an object renders.  If this is so, what would be the optimal
.range of sizes? (pretty subjective question, huh?).  My question comes up
.because I am attempting to render a fluted column.  The flutes tend to get
.lost when the object is at a smaller scale, thus all I really get is bunch
.of jagged lines.


Indeed, Imagine has a fixed resolution for the placement of points. A
point position is stored as four bytes in a fixed-point notation.  The
smallest details Imagine can resolve are 1/65536 of a unit (REALLY
small!)  and if you scale your object so that the serperation between
points are closer (or just near) this value, you might start seeing
evil results as points merge and cannot be resolved from one another.
On the other end of the scale, you can place points in a volume that
is 65536 units wide (-32767 to 32768).  If you scale a point outside
of this range, usually the sign of the position will change and
your object geometry will be hopelessly toasted. When you scale those
coordinates too high, you just end up spraying your points almost
randomly in space (not a pretty sight.) Scaling too small _can_ cause
these problems, but it usually just lumps details together and makes a
useless pellet of an object.

The best sizes to use are probably on the range of 10-100. This is a
comfortable size to deal with, and also fits well with the default
"world size" of +-1024. (That's a whole seperate topic!)

If you are getting twisted lines, etc, you are either **WAY** too
small or more likely **WAY** too big. The other problem you could be
running into is a large bug in Imagine 2.0 that really thrashes Forms
objects saved from 1.1, turning your nice airplane wings into
pipe-cleaner art sculptures.

-Steve

---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Steve Worley                                        [e-mail]
---------------------------------------------------------------------------

##

Subject: Conform To Path
Date: Sat, 25 Jan 92 10:08:51 -0800
From: [e-mail]

Does anyone know how to use Conform to Path?  I quote the manual:

    "For the moment, we have to leave Conform to Path for a later portion
     of this manual."

Aaagh!  My fairly aimless experiments have produced "interesting" results.
Any advice?

    Stefon
    [e-mail]

##

Subject: Animation upload to hubcap
Date: Sat, 25 Jan 92 13:13:44 MST
From: [e-mail] (Brian Ridout)

Hi all,

I have just uploaded a 60 frame lores animation to hubcap.
it is in /pub/amiga/incoming/graphics/Fly-P51.LZH.
This was done using Imagine 2.0 and P51.iob from Imagine 2.0
objects disk.

Thanks

Brian Ridout
[e-mail]

##

Subject: Upgrade to 2.0
Date: Sat, 25 Jan 92 12:44:14 -0800
From: [e-mail] (Chihtsung Jeffrey Lin)

     Hello, this is the first time I'm posting. I was thinking about upgrading
to imagine 2.0. My question is, is it worth $100 for the upgrade? And does
it actually comes with a comprehensive 200-page manual like it claims in the
newsgroup? Can anyone with 2.o answer these questions. Thanks in advance.

                                         Jeff :-)

##

Subject: Re: Single Frame Controllers
Date: Sat, 25 Jan 92 12:27:13 PST
From: [e-mail]

> Anyway, to get things going, I have a question.... To those of you doing
> single frame recording, what are you using as a recording medium. I have
> pretty much exclusively been using recordable video discs (both the Teac
> LV-210A and Panasonic 3031). While they are wonderful to work with,
> extremely quick and flexible, and provide quite good image quality, they
> are prone to dropouts. I just got off the phone with Perry from ASDG who
> is refering to his brand new Panasonic 3031 as a "$17,000 dot generator"
> (not to affectionately I might add). So what are you using for LightWave?
> U-Matic SP? Betacam SP? Anyone have the NewTek D2 output thingy> ? And if
> you are using discs, are you using any sort of dropout compensation?

OK Mark, I'll take the bait. At Calarts we are currently using a
Mini-Vas hooked up to U-Matic SP decks (Sony 9000 series to be exact).
We can output from either of our two toasters to any of 3 SP decks via
a patch-bay and switcher box. I have written several programs for control
for this setup via AREXX.

    1) Conversion from any Amiga format image to toaster Framestore.

    2) Complete control of single framing to tape from outside Lightwave
         (still using the Toaster as output device this as been used
         mainly for outputing Imagine renders to tape via the Toaster.)

    3) Complete control of sequential frame GRABBING. This is great for
         "live" animated brushmaps. It is getting used quite a lot.

    4) Conversion from Toaster Framestore images to any Amiga Iff
         format (for #3 above).

Basically students are able to generate renders from any program and output
them to tape with the Toaster. They are also able to grab frames from a
video source sequentially so that they can map them onto an object for an
animated brushmap. There are several students doing something like robot
POV shots where they want to grab video, convert it to HAM or DCTV, then
add hand animation, like flashing computer sceen info, along the edges
to either send back to tape or use as a new animated brushmap.

In addition to this we have a spectacular new device which has only recently
become availabe called the "Image Node". It is made by Diaquest. We received
the first one to be shipped, but I believe anyone can get them now. It is
essentially a computer in itself. It's works as an Ethernet node which is
a display device AND single frame controller in one. You send it your
images via Ethernet (not sending video, but digital information, the
best quality possible) and it displays and single frames it (it also
grabs). We have it hooked to a S-VHS Panasonic AG-7850 deck (Yes folks,
Super VHS is BETTER quality than U-Matic {but not laser disk, right Mark}).
The Image Node is built to handle many, many different kinds of recording
devices, including laser disk. Unfortunately, most of you won't care about
the Image Node because you already have a display device, like a DCTV or
Toaster or Firecracker. And also most of you won't be able to use it anyway
because you probably don't have Ethernet cards in your Amigas. We do because
our entire Amiga lab and Iris labs are ethernetted together.  But it is a
very nice device.

Thirdly, we also have the capability to record on 16mm film. This is done
through a "black box" we have built. Enclosed within is a Mitchell 16mm
film camera pointing at a high resolution monitor (1040x1280) with a
display device attached (actually an Iris). It is tweaked optimally
and you cannot tell that it was shot off of a monitor (unless you get out
a magnifying glass and look at the film :-).

At any rate, we have not had any problems with dropouts or missed frames at
all (actually, I was getting dropouts yesterday on the Image Node, but only
because I needed to clean the heads on the deck). Every one of these devices
is quite nice in it's own way. The Mini-Vas can be a bit flaky at times,
but it is usually not something a power reset won't fix. It is my understanding
that the people that make the Mini-Vas are now making (might not be
available yet) the same thing in a "card" form that you can just plug into
your machine.

=========================================================================
Sean Schur                        INTERNET ADDRESSES:
Assistant Director Amiga/Media Lab               [e-mail]
Character Animation Department                   [e-mail]
California Institute of the Arts
=========================================================================

##

Subject: transparency
Date: Sat, 25 Jan 92 21:39:05 PST
From: [e-mail] (Kevin Kodama)

ok, i may have asked this before, but i' m still having trouble...
i am trying to use invisible transparency maps. i am still seeing the
ghosting of the plane i am mapping onto (it is not invisible completely)

i have changed the full scale values, am not using dpaint, and have also
tried steve worley's lattice maps from his wonderful book, and still
the transparent parts show up darker....i am *almost* sure i have tried
every combination of settings, to no avail.

any ideas ?
thanks in advance,

kevin

##

Subject: TTDDD
Date: Sat, 25 Jan 92 21:57:53 -0800
From: [e-mail]

I can't seem to find the TTDDD stuff on ab20.larc.nasa.gov   :-(
I looked in the amiga/graphics dir, but "plotting" ain't there no more.  Where
might I find TTDDD now?

Stefon
[e-mail]

##

Subject: Re: transparency
Date: Sat, 25 Jan 92 22:37:53 -0800
From: [e-mail]

As I understand it, no matter what else is going on, the Full Scale Value needs
to be 255.  I know I've had it work using a DPaint image with no troubles.  I
suppose this doesn't help much, but I know it _can_ work!

Stefon

##

Subject: transparency II
Date: Sat, 25 Jan 92 23:19:16 PST
From: [e-mail] (Kevin Kodama)

okay, this is getting strange. i create a plane, color 0,0,0, etc.
transparency 255,255,255. no brush mapping at all. i render the plane in
trusty imagine 1.1.fp the plane is not there, of course, completely
transparent :)

i load the same plane into 2.0, render, and i can *see* the plane !
the imagine fp file is 595,636 bytes, and was created i believe dec 20, 1991.
does anyone have a later version ? or am i doing something incredibly
wrong (and stupid:))

btw, for those not too initially enthralled w/imagine 2.0, if its been a
while, boot up old 1.1 again. transparency not withstanding, the upgrade
suddenly seems *quite* substantial !
kevin
[e-mail]

##

Subject: Re: transparency II
Date: Sat, 25 Jan 92 23:41:18 -0800
From: [e-mail]

There is a bug in that version of 2.0.  It's even worse if you try to trace
a curved transparent object with two or more light sources.  Thankfully, there
is a newer version than yours.  Its 595,640 bytes and was created on Jan 2,
1992.

I don't know what Impulse is doing about it.  But what pisses me off is that
they released a ray-tracer with an obvious bug in the renderer.  Oh, well...

Stefon
[e-mail]

##

Subject: Re: Conform To Path
Date:    Sun, 26 Jan 92 14:48 EST
From: "Marc Rifkin" <[e-mail]>

I have had marginal success with Conform to Path- it does not seem to
let me stretch an object to the entire length of a path, regardless of
how they are scaled relatively- it just warps the object along a
smaller central part of the path.

So when do we get path warping as an EFFECT???
B-)
Marc Rifkin
Integrative Technologies Lab, Penn State University
5F Mitchell Building, University Park, PA 16802
814-863-8062 or for you normal people, [e-mail]
"Say, that's a nice bug."

##

Subject: Re: Conform To Path
Date: Sun, 26 Jan 92 18:34:03 -0500
From: [e-mail] (Michael B. Comet)

>
>
>
>I have had marginal success with Conform to Path- it does not seem to
>let me stretch an object to the entire length of a path, regardless of
>how they are scaled relatively- it just warps the object along a
>smaller central part of the path.
>
>So when do we get path warping as an EFFECT???
  ^^^^^^^^^try making 2 objects and morphing!

>B-)
>Marc Rifkin
>Integrative Technologies Lab, Penn State University
>5F Mitchell Building, University Park, PA 16802
>814-863-8062 or for you normal people, [e-mail]
>"Say, that's a nice bug."
  ^^^^ YESSSSSSSSSSSS   !!!!!!   :)

##

Date: Mon, 27 Jan 92 13:16:21 GMT
From: [e-mail] (leon anthony art hurst)

Do the lands that come with sceneryanimator load into imagine?

Also how many lores 32color frames is there in an animation of
Anim5 format of 2.7-2.8 meg?

##

Subject: imagine 2.0 in Europe
Date: Mon, 27 Jan 92 13:46:34 +0100
From: [e-mail] (LACOMBE Bruno)

 Here's a strange story. An Imagine friend, Fabrice BARROIS, as a lot of
people, receive the Imagine NewsLetter from IMPULSE, so, like a lot of people
(except me), he orders imagine 2.0 at IMPULSE. About three weeks later, he
received imagine 2.0 PAL.
 Documentation is good, imagine 2.0 works fine (include with DCTV).

first question : Did the 'lot of people' receive imagine 2.0 in PAL ?

 I didn't order my 2.0 'cause the French import promise me a free one. But for
the moment, the importer does not receive any imagine 2.0 , only imagine 1.1.

second question : Is it normal that registered users receive imagine 2.0
BEFORE the french import ?

 The current European import is MEMPHIS COMPUTER. They do the job really well,
not only they import imagine,but they stimulate the market  by selling a lot
of complement , like objects, mapping, etc... They also have very good
relation with all the imagine clubs of germany. So I phone to MEMPHIS. They
said me that imagine 2.0 is not ready in PAL, and the manual is not printed .
BUT I SAW AN IMAGINE 2.0 IN PAL WITH ITS MANUAL (and it work fine). They don't
beleive me because Impulse send them only a NTSC version with NO manual.

third question : Does they said the truth ?
  If not , does they try to sell the stock of imagine 1.1 ?

  If yes , is it normal that a simple user receive imagine 2.0 BEFORE the
European importer ?

  Have Fabrice Barrois a test version of imagine 2.0 for bugs indentification
before the real lauch of imagine 2.0 ?

 I don't think so.

End of the little story.

 Now a little imagine 2.0 bug report made with the Fabrice's imagine 2.0.

    PICK RANGE crash when you enter a number bigger than the number of points
of the objects.

    IMAGINE crash when you select PICK POINTS with a real sphere ( ADD/SPHERE ).

    Imagine 2.0 can't read Imagine 1.1 Form objects.

    The quickrender preference is set for the FIRECRACKER by default.

    Imagine 2.0 don't recognised Imagine 1.1 textures.

    Default color are horrible ( personnal remark ).

that's all.

 But, according to me, imagine 2.0 is GREAT ! I like all the new features, and
once you use them, you couldn't do without.

                                           Frangois GASTALDO

  send your response to lacombe@platon or to the imagine mailing list.

------------------------------------------------------------
\\\__________\            F. G. P.            /__________///
///          /  Frangois GASTALDO Productions \          \\\
------------------------------------------------------------

##

Subject: Animations on VCR, graphics cards
Date: Mon, 27 Jan 92 13:41:35 +0100
From: [e-mail] (LACOMBE Bruno)

 First, I want to say that our videotape was made for MicroPunch, the IMAGINE
french importator. This tape is for first-time imagine user, and I'm sure that
most of you don't find it very interesting.
 The tape is sold with Imagine in FRANCE, and it was made to be a 3 hour
handbook videotape. The text is FRENCH.

>Are there difficulties with tv type ( Secam or PAL )?.

 No. The tape is avaible in SECAM, PAL and S-VHS.

>Did you record simply ram anim or single frame..

 I just use RAM animations, all were played by AmigaVision ( an excellent
piece of software ). However, they are not HAM anim, they are DCTV anim, wich
play faster and are better looking.
 The tape was made with a 'consumers' S-VHS VCR ( Thompson S 4000 ), and was
recorded directly with the DCTV encoder. The diference between the Amiga
screen and tape was never noticeable ( except for the COLOR-Wire picture ).

> I have a .... . Could this VCR record my anims?

 Any PAL VCR can record Amiga RAM animations, the only thing you should have
is an encoder. But for single frame animations, it is rather different. You
should have the right controller and the right VCR.
 The S-VHS Panasonic NVFS 100 EG is perhaps the right one, but I don't know if
it exists in Europe (in PAL), and , if so, what is its European name ?

 If you have any information about this VCR, please send me a letter.

 I saw a demonstration of single frame recording at the AMIGA-Expo KOLN, but
the VCR was an expensive SONY BETA-SP ...

 I plan to make a second imagine tape, for advanced users. It will be made of
explanation of some complex tips like soft-edge spots, good looking lamp and
light bulb, complex morphing between -not same number of points- objects, and
more stuffs ...
 This tape will be availble in PAL or S-VHS, in FRENCH, in ENGLISH, and perhaps
in GERMAN and ITALIAN ...
 If you are interested by this tape, please send me a mail.

> Wich graphics card would you prefer ?

 Waaoooo, what a question ???? Very hard to make an objective response ! So I
just tell you what I think about all the graphics card I know. And I know lot
of them: VideoToaster, IV24, VD 2001, DCTV, HAM-E+, FireCracker, Harlequin,
Colorburst, AVIDEO 24, X-PERT .

 I proceed by alphabetical order, and I just talk about our principal interest:
Graphics quality and 3D.

 AVIDEO24, it is a french card that offers true RGB 24 bit in 704*560 for only
824$ (with a$ at 5.4 Francs). The only problem is that it is VERY slow.
Display an single picture from RAM take 0.5 second ! From disk, it is
incredebly SLOOOOWWWW.
   This mean that you can't paint in 24 bit , but only in 12 bit. You can't
make animation too. The (12bit) painter for this card (TV-PAINT) costs an
extra 370 $.

 Colorburst. Good. Not fast, like most of the others. Software are not great
but they work.

 DCTV. The small one who make big noise. An encoder (PAL or NTSC), a
digitalizer and a 6 Millions color card in a black box. I was surprised by the
quality of the encoder, not BROADCAST, but better than most I know.
   I've never used the Digit (I own a SNAPSHOT). DCTV Paint is the most
incredible 24 bit painter I saw, I'll never use DIGIPAINT or DPAINT IV
anymore. The best of all is that there are many software who directly support
this card , include:
   Scenery Animator, IMAGINE 2.0 ( GREAT ) , Animation:Journeyman, 3DPRO ( I
HATE this soft), ADPRO 2.0( GREAT ), Real 3D, VISTAPRO 2.0, DRAW-4D PRO, and
many others ...
   The thing I prefer is that you could save your pic in a standard IFF-ILBM
Hires format , so almost any software can display and animate your near-24bit
pictures ! One last point: DCTV is VERY fast (on my 3000-UX).
   The major drawback is that it is not a RGB card, only PAL or NTSC on your
TV or analog monitor ( no multisync. ).

 FireCracker 24 : Not ready in PAL. It seems that it is one the best card in
quality and rapidity. But no anim. The one I saw have incredible contrast and
color, and it is a real pleasure to click on the 'USE FIRECRACKER' button.
   Light24 seems incredible.

   Impulse says that IMAGINE 2.0 is completly compatible with the FIRECRACKER,
does they mean that you can open the editors in 1024*482 ?

 HAM-E+. forget it. Softwares are slow and stupid, quality is ham quality, no
more...

 HARLEQUIN . The most expensive for the greatest quality I've ever seen. TV
PAINT is realy marvelous (better than DCTVPaint , if possible). This card is
FAST (but no anim) and more than BROADCAST in quality.

 IV24 (GVP). A great one with the wrong software. The quality in 24 bit is as
good as the COLORBURST, AV VIDEO24, X-PERT. But bellow HARLQUIN and FIRECRACKER.
    Major drawback: GVP price...

 VideoToaster. PLEASE NEWTEK , MAKE IT IN PAL !!!!! IT IS FAR THE BEST FOR
VIDEO and LIGHWAVE is GREAT (except for the modeler).

 X-PERT. 2048*2048, if you find a monitor to display it. The strangest card of
the market. I think it is good for Scientific use, but not for artistic or
video use.

 Now I give the response: I prefer the DCTV because I can pay it and it work
with IMAGINE 2.0 . But if I could , I buy an HARLEQUIN. And when the TOASTER
exist in PAL , I'll buy it..

 I hope my point of view will help you and, please, send me a mail if you are
interested in my second IMAGINE tape.

                                             Francois GASTALDO

 send your reply to lacombe@platon or on the Imagine mailing list.

------------------------------------------------------------
\\\__________\            F. G. P.            /__________///
///          /  Frangois GASTALDO Productions \          \\\
------------------------------------------------------------
                           ______
                       /|  \    /    |\
             1% with  ( | MicroPunch | )
                       \|    \/      |/

##

Subject: Re: <anim sizes>
Date: Mon, 27 Jan 92 10:06:51 MST
From: [e-mail] (Steve Koren)

[e-mail] (leon anthony art hurst) writes:

> Also how many lores 32color frames is there in an animation of
> Anim5 format of 2.7-2.8 meg?

It depends on a lot of things.  For example, it depends on how much
"difference" there is in between two anim frames.  For animations
with a fixed observer, often a large part of the screen is constant
between frames, so the .anim file only stores the differences.
For animations with a moving observer, often most or all of the
screen changes between frames, so the deltas will be larger.

For moving observer animations, I usually get between 110 and
160 frames of 32 color 320x200 frames, or half that for 320x400
in 2.7 mb of file space.  (Ie, figure 22 to 25K delats).

For fixed observer animations, I usually get between 250 and
500 frames in the same 2.7 mb.  (Although this can vary a lot
with the animation in question).

There are tricks you can use to reduce the size of the .anim file.
For example, suppose you have a moving viewpoint animation.  If you
make the entire sky the same color (non gradient), it will be constant
between frames, and so the resulting deltas will be smaller.

Also, if you have an animation bigger than your available RAM, you
can use a program to play the animation directly from HD.  The
results vary from horrible to extremely good depending on the
animation, your drive speed, your controller bandwidth, your controller
CPU use during disk I/O, and several other factors.  Amiga 3000s
should do a good job at this.

> Do the lands that come with sceneryanimator load into imagine?

Oddly enough, although I own both programs, I've never tried this.
I doubt it would work directly.  However, Scenery Animator will
render the terrain *much* faster than Imagine will, so perhaps
you could simply render the terrain there and then paste Imagine
rendered objects into the frames with a paint program?

   - steve

##

Subject: Archive server
Date: Mon, 27 Jan 92 09:46:06 PST
From: [e-mail] (Kevin W. Hobbs)

Hi everyone, my first post, please bear with me...

I've looked through the Compendium and Appendix by Worley and now
one days worth of this mailer and haven't noticed whether or
not the abcfd20.larc.nasa.gov or hubcap.clemson.edu had mail
servers/archive servers. I don`t have internet ftp because
the Boeing Company is to paranoid... :(

Thanks
Kevin Hobbs

##

Subject: SceneryAnimator -> Imagine
Date: Mon, 27 Jan 92 08:40:49 PST
From: [e-mail]

>Do the lands that come with sceneryanimator load into imagine?

Not directly. However, they will load into VistaPro 2.0 (to be
released on Feb. 14, 1992) and from there they can be cookie-cut
and saved as Imagine-format objects. However however :-) both
Scenery Animator and VistaPro's developers source their Data
Elevation Maps (DEMs) from the same place: the United States
Geological Survey (USGS) and the data supplied in bothSA's and
VP's .scape files are basically the same. SA uses a slightly
different .scene file format from Vista's and SA can currently
load Vista files but, the current release of Vista Pro can't
load SA's files.. yet... as stated above, VistaPro 2.0 will
be able to load SA's .scape files.  Have I confused you enough
yet? :-)

Regards, Harv

##

Subject: Transparency revisited
Date: Mon, 27 Jan 92 19:39:57 PST
From: [e-mail]

I, too am having transparency troubles under 2.0.  If the transparent object
is in front of another object, the background object renders clear through.
If, on the other hand, the transparent object is only in front of sky, you
(I, anyway) get blotchy grey, instead of transparent object.  Worse still,
I have the aforementioned Jan 2, 1992 version and the bug is in it.

In other irritations, the fact that Imagine 2.0 does not scale F/X to the
Size Bar information has disrupted an ongoing project for me...

[e-mail]

##

Subject: brush mapping a ground
Date: Mon, 27 Jan 92 23:43:13 PST
From: [e-mail]

My first post, er, question to the Imagine mailing list:
        I'm trying to map a brush to a ground in Imagine2.0. I'm just learning
Imagine (finally, a helpful manual) going thru the tutorial etc.
        Now, I realize that a ground is a special object and cannot be rotated
What I  want is to mapa brush onto the ground. The 2.0 map placement routines
seem to make the proper assumptions for the attitude of the ground, but the
assumptions about the attitude of the brush itself seem to be incorrect.
The brush pixels are mapped thru the  Y dimension, altho the brush is given
a Y size of 2 pixels or something. I've tried rotating 90 degrees in X and
rescaling Y and Z, to swap the dimensions given by the import process and then
tile and mirror. It then seems to be oriented correctly but it will not cover
the entire ground.
        I haven't finished the 2.0 manual yet so this might be covered later,
if so excuse this question. Does anyone do this?
        Thanx,  DeVoid@.cup.portal.com  > David Lyall

er, I think I meant a Z size of 2, while the brush is mapped thru Z. ?

##

Subject: Re: Conform To Path
Date: Tue, 28 Jan 92 01:48:54 CST
From: telepro![e-mail] (James Hastings-Trew)

In a message dated Sat 25 Jan 92 12:45, [e-mail] wrote:

 UCS> Does anyone know how to use Conform to Path?  I quote the manual:

 UCS>  "For the moment, we have to leave Conform to Path for a later
 UCS> portion
 UCS>   of this manual."

 UCS> Aaagh!  My fairly aimless experiments have produced "interesting"
 UCS> results.
 UCS> Any advice?

Yes

1> place the path to conform to in the approximate relationship to the
object that you would like to acheive. That is, if you have a tubular
object, and you wish to conform to the path as if the path were in the
centre of the tube, then put the axis of the path in the centre of the
object.

2> The object will conform to the length of the path in (Y) but still
maintain it's original scale in (Z) and (X). Bear this in mind when
creating the path. That is to say, if you have a great big tube, and a
little tiny path, then the tube will be scrunched to fit the length of the
path, but the width and height will remain the same.

3> What conform to path basically does is this: it scales the object in (Y)
to fit the length, and then transposes each point to follow the (X) and (Z)
variations in the path. I have not tried it, but I don't think that conform
to path will work with a path that is tied in a knot or crosses over itself
- my impression is that it works with simple paths only. If you want wild
stuff, then use extrude to path...

4> Tutorial: make a plane (30 x 30 divisions with a 500 x 500 size should
do nicely). Add an axis. In the right-hand view ADD LINES to the axis to
draw a wavey line - like a sine wave. In the Top view, DRAG POINTS on the
path to make a wavey line as well. In the attributes requestor, name this
object PATH. MOVE it to the approximate centre of your plane, and SCALE it
so it is the same length (Y) as the plane. Pick the plane and CONFORM TO
PATH. You should see exactly what this does after doing this.

-- Via DLG Pro v0.986b

*-------------------------------------------------------------------------*
telepro![e-mail]
Watching a room full of people using Macs reminds me of that old
Vonnegut story about making everyone wear dark sunglasses, earplugs,
and concrete blocks on their feet, so everyone will be equally handicapped
*-------------------------------------------------------------------------*

##

Subject: news from hubcap...please read!
Date: Tue, 28 Jan 92 9:22:48 EDT
From: [e-mail] (Doug Dyer)

I have asked Mike if it is possible to backup the imagine area on tape.
If anyone has the capability (ie: hardware,time) to take this tape and
help a "imagine library" (any BBS owners?) here is what he can do:
--------------
I can make you a nine track mag tape (standard reel) of the amiga area. Let
me know if that's what you want.

-Mike
---------------

Id also suggest that if anyone can do this that we upload lots of good
stuff :).  then I will delete old pictures that we have all had a chance
to get and make ample room for us.

perhaps impulse would like the tape?


--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Doug Dyer     *      Clemson University     *     [e-mail]
Quote 'O Fun: DOS is a bike without the seat.           skydive naked
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

##

Subject: Questions about Imagine 1.1
Date: Tue, 28 Jan 92 15:01:02 MET
From: Markus Stipp <[e-mail]>

Hello all Imagineers !

I'm new on this list and I'm a new user of Imagine 1.1, too.

Imagine 2.0 is not available in PAL and the NTSC-Version doesn't work
on PAL-Amigas. So I have to use 1.1 for a few weeks now (until 2.0 is
available in PAL). And I have a few questions about it.

Convert IFF/ILBM:

The Reference Manual sais on page 19 that "The user must select wheter the
program will only create the outline of the object or wheter  the program
should atempt to automatically fill the imported object with faces."
Imagine creates only the outline in my version. It doesn't ask if it should
create faces or not. Is it possible to bring Imagine 1.1 up to do so ?

Imagine.config:

I tried to assign the Lock-Mode of the Detail Editor to a function key. This
doesn't seem to work. With the Select-modes there are no problems. With
"FD06 4d1" you assign the Click-Method to F6, but "FD0x 4d4" does not work !


Because I think that most of you use V2.0, please reply only in private mail.

Thank you...

--

   ...Markus Stipp !!   ([e-mail])

##

Subject: Anim5 Vs ImagineFmt
Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1992 17:25 GMT
From: [e-mail]

which is better for speed of animations and why?

    Anim5 or The Imagine Animation Format ?

##

Subject: imagine<->op5
Date: Tue, 28 Jan 92 13:34:09 EST
From: [e-mail] (John Rosner)

Wouldn't it be nice if there were a utility to convert from an Imagine
anim to Op5 and back?  Then I wouldn't be so stressed at having to make
that decision each time.  :-)

Later

John Rosner

##

Subject: new Boing effect for Imagine 2.0 owners
Date: Tue, 28 Jan 92 17:00:07 PST
From: [e-mail]

This is posted to the Imagine mailing list with the blessings
(and encouragement) of Steve Gillmor, VP of Software, Impulse, Inc.,
who posted this as a binary upload in the Impulse Vendor Support
area in the Amiga Zone on The Portal System. This is a replacement
"Boing" effect for those owners of Imagine 2.0 who may have gotten
a non-functional Boing effect. Check yours. if it is not 13088
bytes long, capture this one, run it thru uuDEcode, unpack the
resulting .LZH file and copy the effect into your Imagine 2.0
"effects" drawer. Should solve the problems.  Not everyone will
need this fixed Boing effect so check yours first and if it's
already 13088 bytes long, you don't have to bother with this one.
Have Fun
Harv Laser
Moderator/Sysop: the Amiga Zone (on) The Portal System
disclaim time: I'm not an agent nor employee of Impulse Inc.. just
doing Steve Gillmor a favor.

------[cut here... run the remainder thru uudecode]-----

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M_39__FJ:XVP,.RO(,WR+@.69/IG%J`[:H;@'7<`[#BG9TM?;BO9%C7^W]XA]Q
MUMMN^/CG02S7T-^Y5\=!+965S(VU5C#@60-6^>*B'NXS;OZ0>=JL.Y/W)7.;M
M3TI>XPCKM=XARV&KA^&`*?.MX-\=AX;VLT/@V5L0;-+).(C#?(L-N:+8&X\PM
MWW)AN/:$-ZQAM&+#9_._#=3E'_/-L-]="VNM^J*Y*@RKQB^'.M.4.PW>(6J%7
M_T[ANBX;;W6O.B^-N-;2GH9)M=*<GWS*'_"=RX>*<=7$+<\W-O-2+C66ZUAY$
;E#>:]AC.6L@GG%1`Y+6\<WC.,P??D+\OG!8`1
``
end
size 6102

##

Subject: new Boing effect for Imagine 2.0 owners (fwd)
Date: Wed, 29 Jan 92 8:41:36 CST
From: camelot![e-mail]

>
> This is posted to the Imagine mailing list with the blessings
> (and encouragement) of Steve Gillmor, VP of Software, Impulse, Inc.,
> who posted this as a binary upload in the Impulse Vendor Support
> area in the Amiga Zone on The Portal System. This is a replacement
> "Boing" effect for those owners of Imagine 2.0 who may have gotten
> a non-functional Boing effect. Check yours. if it is not 13088
> bytes long, capture this one, run it thru uuDEcode, unpack the
> resulting .LZH file and copy the effect into your Imagine 2.0
> "effects" drawer. Should solve the problems.  Not everyone will
> need this fixed Boing effect so check yours first and if it's
> already 13088 bytes long, you don't have to bother with this one.
> Have Fun
> Harv Laser
> Moderator/Sysop: the Amiga Zone (on) The Portal System
> disclaim time: I'm not an agent nor employee of Impulse Inc.. just
> doing Steve Gillmor a favor.
>
> ------[cut here... run the remainder thru uudecode]-----

    I am not familiar with what uudecode is.  Could someone please
    explain what it is and how it is used.



--

        ____________________________^__________________________________

        dale r. rogers               Email:  ingr!b24a!camelot!dale
                                     Internet:
                                     ingr!b24a!camelot![e-mail]


                                    .

##

Subject: Re: new Boing effect for Imagine 2.0 owners (fwd)
Date: Thu, 30 Jan 92 08:35:44 PST
From: [e-mail]

>
>    I am not familiar with what uudecode is.  Could someone please
>    explain what it is and how it is used.
>
>
>
>--
>
>        ____________________________^__________________________________
>
>        dale r. rogers               Email:  ingr!b24a!camelot!dale

Put simply, you cannot transmit binary programs and files over the
usenet/internet, only 7-bit ASCII text data. However there are ways
to convert binary to text, transmit it (as I did with the Boing2.LZH
file) and then turn it back into binary after receiving it.
uuENcode and uuDEcode make a pair of programs to do exactly this.
These are Unix utilities which have been re-coded to run on Amigas.
Obviously I can't post uuDEcode here since you'd need uuDEcode to
decode it! :-) so you'll have to hunt around to find a copy.
There's a very old uudecode on Fish disk#38 which may still be
functional. Check your local BBSes, pay services like Portal,
user group, other local users, etc. It should not be difficult to
find the Amiga versions of uuen/decode.  If you're "calling" this
mailing list via a unix system, then those utilities should exist
right there, and you could uudecode my letter right on the unix box
and then transfer it down to your Amiga as binary.

Regards, Harv

p.s.. perhaps someday in some perfect future, Commodore will see
fit to actually include some useful telecomm utilities with their
system software instead of stuff like Notepad. :-/

##

Subject: Necessity is the mother of invention
Date: Thu, 30 Jan 92 13:25:12 EST
From: [e-mail]

As I was trying to get some pictures rendered last night for the
February AmiExpo art contest, I was under a REAL time crush.
Unfortunately I was working on several renderings simultaneously
(designing one, rendering another in the background) but I stupidly
crashed the computer. PANIC! I had a render that had been working for
10 hours, and was 3/4 of the way done. I had not choice but to
rerender it from scratch! But it would take HOURS I didn't have.

The solution? An elegant trick that I'll probably use as a tool in the
future.  I had 3/4 of the picture, I just wanted to finish the last
portion.  Unfortunately you can't tell Imagine to render just part of
an image.  [mega :-( ]

What did I do? I saved the 3/4 picture as a different filename. Then I
went into the Stage editor and FLIPPED THE CAMERA UPSIDE DOWN. (Rotate
local Y for 180 degrees). I then rendered the image, stopping Imagine
when it was about 30% of the way done. The camera-flipped rendered
image is just the BOTTOM of the original scene! Using ADPro, I flipped
the bottom part so it was rightside up, then composited it on top of
the original 3/4 image.  Tahdah! A seamless join!

It it important NOT to move the camera or change the scene if you try
this trick, but it's really pretty easy to do. It saved me 10 hours of
rendering time, too!


-Steve

---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Steve Worley                                        [e-mail]
---------------------------------------------------------------------------

##

Subject: Happy swede + aspect values
Date: Thu, 30 Jan 92 18:43:13 +0100
From: [e-mail] (Goeran Ehrsson)

Yes Yes Yesssss... It's here!

I ordered the 2.0 upgrade a few weeks ago but I did not send a check as
Impulse suggested, instead I sent a xerox of my credit card along with
a letter where I wanted them to confirm the order by fax.
A few weeks passed and I didn't here a thing from Impulse so I began to
think they put my order aside.
But when I came home from work late last night there was a box on my desk
from Impulse. Yippieee!
I've heard the roomers "PAL version not ready" so I was a bit nervous
when I tried the program. But no reason to be,
It's PAL, it's dated January 14, and it's great!        Thanx!

And guess what I found on my desk when I came home today...
"Understanding Imagine 2.0 by Steven Worley"   Weeeeeeeeeeee!
Thank you for the fast delivery Steve!

This should keep me busy for a while   :-)

Now a question regarding the rendering presets,
I noticed the aspect values for PAL is    HAM/320x256        x=18, y=17
                                          Laced HAM/320x512  x=36, y=17
                                          Hires 640x512      x=18, y=17
Is this correct?
If it is, it's means I guessed wrong in 1.1 (x=~7 y=~6)
because my 1.1 projects renders to tall, everything is stretched vertical,
my spheres looks like eggs.

Does someone have the correct aspect values for PAL?

- Goran

--
Goran Ehrsson                              |      /// Imagine Me and my Amiga.
[e-mail]                            |     /// The relationship grows
...!uunet!mcsun!sunic!abalon!goran         | \\\/// in three dimensions.
Abalon AB, Box 11129,161 11 Bromma,SWEDEN. |  \XX/

##

Subject: 3D Object BBS
Date: Thu, 30 Jan 92 13:46:03 -0500
From: [e-mail] (Elizabeth E Sack)

For those of you that are farther away from civilization than I am in Indiana
you might not have heard about Studio BBS.  It is devoted entirely to 3D
objects for Imagine, Turbo Silver, Draw 4D, and LightWave.  There is also
a directory for 24 bit IFF and LightWave pictures.

The phone number is:
            817/467-3658

The sysop, Jody Reimers, runs the board on an upload/download credit system.
So, the more you contribute, the more you can benefit.

There are some excelent objects of the StarTrek The Next Generation ships
(Federation and alien) on line there.  Also, there is a complete Batman
animation setup file for Imagine.  It takes two (2) days to render on and
'030 (25mHz) accelerated 2000.

So, login and enjoy.

J. Hanna
Studio J Video Productions

##

Subject: format conversion
Date: Thu, 30 Jan 92 15:27:33 EST
From: [e-mail] (Steve Brailsford)

Does anyone know if there is a utility to convert from
the mac program Swivel 3D and imagine or other Amiga
modeling format?  Swivel is a pretty nice program, but
I need it on the Amiga for imagine's effects, and other
hardware reasons.


--
    Steve Brailsford ([e-mail])   _____
    Usenet:  uupsi!vitro!sparc!fsb         \/itro Corporation
    Voice:  [phone]                  14000 Georgia Ave.
    Fax:    [phone]                  Silver Spring, MD 20906

##

Subject: Rendering part of a scene...
Date: 30 Jan 92 16:16 -0600
From: "Jeff A. Bell" <[e-mail]>

[Steve Worley discusses flipping the camera...]

> It it important NOT to move the camera or change the scene if you try
> this trick, but it's really pretty easy to do. It saved me 10 hours of
> rendering time, too!

Interesting trick.  This would have saved me some time on a couple of
occasions.  Whatever happened to the 'render zone' option that was in
Turbo Silver anyways?  Did Impulse think that nobody used it?  I really
liked that feature, to solve problems such as the one you experienced,
and to speed up rendering when you don't need a full screen render.

Anybody else get any use out of that now-defunct feature?

Ciao,

Jeff
--
[e-mail]

##

Subject: UUdecode
Date: Thu, 30 Jan 92 22:49:43 MST
From: [e-mail] (Ben Scott)

Harv - I keep copies of UUencode and UUdecode in both generic BASIC
and C on my account for just such an emergency... They SHOULD work with
fairly few changes if any.  Here's uudecode.bas (sorry for those of you
who don't need it):

--------------------------------------------------------------
'This Amiga Basic program uudecodes files.
'It may not be fast, but it works!
'I have an analogous uuencode program if anyone wants it.
'    Michael Creutz
'    [e-mail]
'
WINDOW 1,,(20,20)-(400,150)
DEFINT a-z
INPUT "File to decode:",f1$
INPUT "Decoded file name:",f2$
OPEN f1$ FOR INPUT AS #1
OPEN f2$ FOR OUTPUT AS #2
length!=LOF(1)
leftlength!=length!
PRINT "Looking for 'begin.'"
findbegin:
  IF EOF(1) THEN PRINT "begin not found":CLOSE:END
  LINE INPUT #1, a$:leftlength!=leftlength!-LEN(a$)-1
  IF LEFT$(a$,6)<>"begin " THEN GOTO findbegin
  PRINT
  PRINT "'begin' found"
  PRINT "decoding ";f1$;" to file ";f2$
newline:
  LOCATE 10,10
  partdone=100*(1!-leftlength!/length!)
  PRINT partdone;"% finished"
inline:  LINE INPUT #1,a$ :leftlength!=leftlength!-LEN(a$)-1
  IF a$="" THEN GOTO inline
  IF a$="end" THEN GOTO done
  count=(ASC(LEFT$(a$,1))-32) AND 63
  IF count=0 THEN GOTO done
  pointer=2
  out$=""
loop:
  a1=(ASC(MID$(a$,pointer  ,1))-32) AND 63
  a2=(ASC(MID$(a$,pointer+1,1))-32) AND 63
  a3=(ASC(MID$(a$,pointer+2,1))-32) AND 63
  a4=(ASC(MID$(a$,pointer+3,1))-32) AND 63
pointer=pointer+4
count=count-3
  out$=out$+CHR$((a1* 4+a2\16) AND 255)
  out$=out$+CHR$((a2*16+a3\ 4) AND 255)
  out$=out$+CHR$((a3*64+a4   ) AND 255)
IF count>0 THEN GOTO loop
  PRINT #2, out$;
IF NOT EOF(1) THEN GOTO newline
  PRINT "end not found"
done:
  PRINT "all done"
  CLOSE
--------------------------------------------------------------

Hope this helpos.

.                            <<<<Infinite K>>>>

--
.---------------------------------------------------------------------------.
|Ben Scott, professional goof-off and consultant at The Raster Image, Denver|
|Internet [e-mail], or call the Arvada 68K BBS at [phone].|
|-------------------------------------.-.-----------------------------------|
|"I hate to imprison a noble sentiment| |The Raster Image IS responsible for|
|in mere words, but.... bye!" - Larry | |everything I say!  ** Amiga Power**|
`-------------------------------------' `-----------------------------------'

##

Subject: Re:  Necessity is the mother of invention
Date: Fri, 31 Jan 92 15:25:31 -0800
From: [e-mail] (Chihtsung Jeffrey Lin)



>    What did I do? I saved the 3/4 picture as a different filename. Then I
>    went into the Stage editor and FLIPPED THE CAMERA UPSIDE DOWN. (Rotate
>    local Y for 180 degrees). I then rendered the image, stopping Imagine
>    when it was about 30% of the way done. The camera-flipped rendered
>    image is just the BOTTOM of the original scene! Using ADPro, I flipped
>    the bottom part so it was rightside up, then composited it on top of
>    the original 3/4 image.  Tahdah! A seamless join!

    Wow!!! What an eye opener! Now I don't have to worry about a
    rendering once I start it. Thanks Steve!

       P.S. Wish impulse would include a feature like that in a future
       version.


                       Jeff :-)

##

Subject: Imagine BBS
Date: Sun, 02 Feb 92 01:12:37 EST
From: [e-mail]

Amiga World has just made a MAJOR screwup.  In two seperate articles in
their newest issue, they mention "Steve Worley's Imagine BBS" and even
say that "it's a good place to get 3D objects."

I DO NOT RUN A BBS! THEY (FOR SOME UNKNOWN REASON) LISTED MY **HOME**
PHONE NUMBER! THERE IS NO SUCH BBS! DO -NOT- CALL!

Needless to say, I'm quite p*ssed and I'm going to have to get my
phone number changed. Please spread the word NOT to call. I have
already gotten over 30 calls today, the first day after the issue has
hit this stands!

Thanks for not calling...

-Steve

---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Steve Worley                                        [e-mail]
---------------------------------------------------------------------------

##

Subject: U.S. Military Objects
Date: Sun, 2 Feb 92 1:59:51 EST
From: Guess who? <[e-mail]>

[For some reasn, I can't seem to post to the list correctly.]

Does anyone know where to get Imagine objects of U.S. military
aircraft? Primarily, I'm interested in:

B1
M1A1
B2
F4
F14
F16
F17
F18
F19
F22
AH64H

In addition:

LHX
Intruder
Any supercarriers or other misc. vessels...

Any others are welcome...

BTW, they don't *have* to be in Imagine format, but that would help
things a lot.

--
-------------- Why does it happen? Because it happens. -------------
---------------------------------------------- -- RUSH -------------
--------------------------------------------------------------------

##

Subject: Lightwave 3D mail based file-server
Date: Mon, 3 Feb 92 00:51:51 EST
From: [e-mail] (Lightwave Mail-List Admin)

-------------------  Graphics File-Server Info    --------------------

A mail based file server for 3D objects, 24bit JPEG images, GIF images
and image maps is now online for all those with Internet mail access.

The server is the official archive site for the Lightwave 3D mail-list.

Besides the above mentioned image-based files, the server contains many
PD and Shareware graphics utilities for several computer platforms
including Amiga, IBM and Macintosh.

Some samples include:

DKBTRACE    - Raytracer for IBM, Amiga and Mac
RAYSHADE    - Raytracer for the Mac
QRT        - Raytracer for IBM, Amiga and Mac
FRACTINT    - Fractal program for IBM
GIFJPG        - Several versions for Amiga, IBM and Mac
WASP        - Image converter for Amiga
REND        - 24bit to IFF converter for Amiga
PLAY        - Several Autodesk .FLI SVGA Players for IBM
GRASPRT     - Latest player for GRASP anim files (Amiga player also)
GRAPHWRK    - Latest Graphics Workshop for IBM
FLI/ANI     - Several .FLI and .ANI anims for IBM
BADGE        - Killer entries for all 3 years (Amiga)
Objects     - Objects for Imagine, Videoscape, Lightwave and others
Renderings  - JPEGed 24bit images from Mark Thompson and others
Demos        - ImageCels, Caligari, Autodesk 3D Studio and others

Plus much more!  And many more to come!

The server resides on my BBS called "The Graphics BBS".  The BBS is
operational 24 hours a day 7 days a week at the phone number of +1
908/469-0049.  It utilizes a Hayes V-Series 9600 V.42 modem. (soon to
upgrade to a V.32 modem)

If you would like to submit objects, scenes or images to the server,
please pack, uuencode and then mail the files to the address:

    [e-mail]

For information on obtaining files from the server send a mail message
to the address:

    [e-mail]

with the following in the body of the message:

HELP
/DIR

and a help file describing how to use the server and a complete
directory listing will be sent to you via mail.

Enjoy!



Bob Lindabury - Lightwave 3D mail-list administrator

InterNet: [e-mail]       | Raven Enterprises
    UUCP: ...rutgers!bobsbox!lightwave-admin       | 25 Raven Avenue
  BitNet: lightwave-admin%bobsbox.rent.com@pucc    | Piscataway, NJ 08854

##

Subject: Me and a scanner...
Date: Mon, 3 Feb 92 1:19:20 CST
From: [e-mail] (Steve Davis)

It looks like I'll be getting a 600 dpi color scanner as an early birthday
gift.  This will be really useful for gathering texture/brushmap images.  Of
course I'm open to suggestions.  I know there are some good (expensive)
commercial offerings out there.  But, a scanner and the new Art Department
Professional is certainly enough for anyone to make good scans...

Stratocaster

##

Subject: Booleans
Date: Mon, 3 Feb 92 10:43:33 CST
From: [e-mail] (Chad Allen Clarke)

I use wavefront on a regular basis and am very happy with its boolean
operations, is there such a command in Imagine for doing boolean operations?

##

Subject: Re:  Booleans
Date: Mon, 3 Feb 92 16:39:20 EST
From: [e-mail]

Sure. Position the objects you want to cut, select the lot and SLICE. This
will create a hideous mass of objects coresponding to all of the boolean
operations--you can then pick the bits you want to keep, group or join them{
and you are done.

Moo
Frank Branham

##

Subject: Military objects
Date: Mon, 3 Feb 92 16:12:48 EST
From: Guess who? <[e-mail]>

I am looking for 3-D objects (in any Amiga-based 3-D format, though
preferably Imagine) for military vehicles. This includes aircraft
(F-14, F-117), tanks (M1A1), helicopters (AH-64H), ships (U.S.S.
Saratoga, U.S.S. Los Angeles), as well as civilian vehicles such as
the 747, DC-10, petroleum and electric based ground vehicles, etc.
(In fact, any type of land, sea, air, and space-based vessels are
welcome...)

--
-------------- Why does it happen? Because it happens. -------------
---------------------------------------------- -- RUSH -------------
--------------------------------------------------------------------

##

Subject: paths
Date: Mon, 3 Feb 92 13:47:13 CST
From: [e-mail] (Steve E Tietze )

Im have along animation in the making.. but i have a question i have never done much with
paths.. i have 10 megs of ram.. so i can only have a limited acount of frames with is plentiful
but i want to splice my animations together to make a 5 min one or so.. anyway.. i have
a path (path.1) wich the camera follows for the first 200 frames then the path ends.. How
do i get path.2 to take off were the other path ended? i have tried aliging them up but i have
had no success :( is thier another way?

-steve tietze


##

Subject: Re: paths
Date:    Tue, 4 Feb 92 20:45 EST
From: <[e-mail]>

I'm not sure if this answers your question, but try dividing the distance of yo
ur PATH1 by the total number of frames that it is run on for ( the number you g
ave was, i believe, 200) Start your PATH2 that quantity (total distance/200) fr
om the end of the first path. What you have in effect done is make you object g
o very nearly the same distance that it would have if there was a single path i
ncorporating the two (I may be wrong about this, but if I am I'm sure someone h
as the right idea - I'm only an illiterate filmmaker).

##

Subject: Fog
Date: Tue, 4 Feb 92 23:37:34 -0500
From: [e-mail] (Elizabeth E Sack)

Can anybody out there tell me how to set up the fog attribute so that it will
actually cast a shaft of light through it.  I cannot for the life of me seem
to get it to work.

##

Subject: How was Imagine developed?
Date: Tue, 4 Feb 92 21:26:13 -0800
From: Michael Gibson <[e-mail]>

    I am curious as to what software langauges - compilers - development
tools   , etc...   were used to create Imagine. Does anybody know?

                Michael

##

Subject: Font Objects
Date: Wed, 5 Feb 92 10:53:11 PST
From: [e-mail]

Has anybody tried to make large (> 100 points) font objects?  I wanted
to create a font object with as much detail as possible, so I tried
to use 100 point CGTimes -- and ended up with a MESS.  It looked like
half the letters had blown up.  The larger the point size, the greater
the mess.  Things didn't calm down until I dropped below 80 points.

My configuration:

        A3000/25-100
        4 megs fast, 1 meg chip
        A2232 multi-port serial board
        A3070 tape drive

Other than that, I've discovered that creating font objects, and then
sweeping them into unusual shapes is a GREAT way to use up memory.

dave

##

Subject: Re: Font Objects
Date:    Wed, 5 Feb 92 15:34 EST
From: "Marc Rifkin" <[e-mail]>

>Has anybody tried to make large (> 100 points) font objects?  I wanted
>to create a font object with as much detail as possible, so I tried
>to use 100 point CGTimes -- and ended up with a MESS.  It looked like
>half the letters had blown up.  The larger the point size, the greater
>the mess.  Things didn't calm down until I dropped below 80 points.

Me too. I've also had trouble when I let Imagine automatically face
the text. I had to resort to slicing it with a plane.

>Other than that, I've discovered that creating font objects, and then
>sweeping them into unusual shapes is a GREAT way to use up memory.
>
>dave

Hey, I run out of memory doing routine things and I have 7 MB...
Marc Rifkin- Graphics and Multimedia / [e-mail]
"The future is not set, there is no fate but what we make for ourselves."
-John Connor, Terminator 2

##

Subject: Re: Font Objects
Date: Wed, 05 Feb 92 17:07:38 EST
From: Mark Thompson <[e-mail]>

> >Has anybody tried to make large (> 100 points) font objects?

> I've also had trouble when I let Imagine automatically face
> the text. I had to resort to slicing it with a plane.

I highly reccomend you use Pixel 3D for this task. It is far more capable
than Imagine in this respect. And the bigger the 2D image, the better the
3D object. I have had no trouble feeding it 2400x600 images for conversion.
|~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~|
|      `       '        Mark Thompson                 CONCURRENT COMPUTER  |
| --==* RADIANT *==--   [e-mail]        Principal Graphics   |
|      ' Image `        ...!uunet!masscomp!mark       Hardware Architect   |
|     Productions       [phone] [phone]   & General Nuisance   |
|                                                                          |
 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

##

Subject: Re: Font Objects
Date: Wed, 5 Feb 92 13:53:54 -0800
From: [e-mail]

I have only a guess:

     Perhaps generating font objects which are too large makes some of
the coordinates exceed Imagine's limits.  I hope this isn't the case, because
the detail of making a large font object is oh so desirable.  Does 99 work
and 100 not work?  Hmmmm......

Stefon

##

Subject: Re:  Font Objects
Date: Wed, 5 Feb 92 16:26:31 EST
From: [e-mail]

Good. I'm not hallucinating. The breaking point even seems to be 100 points,
because I have an 85-point version that works ok.

HOWEVER. Impulse claims that this feature doesn't work with the new comp.
graph support. So one thing I had been meaning to follow up on is if I
were using a bitmap version on that 85-point CGTimes.

(Because I created bitmap versions for some fonts with fountain--and I forget
which ones are bitmaps.)

Please let me know if you play with it.

And get more memory for those sweeps. I like conform to spline followed by
an extrude along a different spine for really groovy 60's text-looking
things.

Moo
Frank Branham

##

Subject: Re:  Font Objects
Date: Wed, 5 Feb 92 14:23:04 PST
From: [e-mail]

|HOWEVER. Impulse claims that this feature doesn't work with the new comp.
|graph support. So one thing I had been meaning to follow up on is if I
|were using a bitmap version on that 85-point CGTimes.

I can create 50 point CGTimes font objects with no problem.  No bitmap,
either.

And -- even if I create the bitmap version of 100 pt CGTimes, all that changes
is that the object gets created faster.  It still looks like it had a nervous
breakdown.  And don't even THINK about try to face it.

|Please let me know if you play with it.

Consider yourself informed.

|And get more memory for those sweeps. I like conform to spline followed by
|an extrude along a different spine for really groovy 60's text-looking
|things.

I've been planning on maxing out my memory for a while.  Maybe I'll actually
do it soon...

|Frank Branham

dave (but davidbro to my employer)

##

Subject: Multiple instances
Date: Thu, 6 Feb 92 00:46:15 +0100
From: [e-mail] (Goeran Ehrsson)

Question,
If I have, for example 100 instances of the same object loaded into
the stage editor, and this object has a brush map.
Will imagine load 100 copies of the object and the brush map, or just one?
I've done some tests and it seams (sounds) like it's loading EVERY instance.

Is there an upper limit on number of objects in the stage/action editor?

I have plans for an animation with lots of instances of the same object,
and I want to know it now before I start the project.

- Goran

--
Goran Ehrsson                              |      /// Imagine Me and my Amiga.
[e-mail]                            |     /// The relationship grows
...!uunet!mcsun!sunic!abalon!goran         | \\\/// in three dimensions.
Abalon AB, Box 11129,161 11 Bromma,SWEDEN. |  \XX/

##

Subject: Visible light beams
Date: Wed, 05 Feb 92 19:29:11 EST
From: [e-mail]

Elizabeth Sach asks how to make visible light beams with fog.
--

Actually, visible light is pretty easy. Remember that fogged objects
are really just light absorbing volumes in space. (Actually, it's more
like light _tinting_ volumes.) You want any ray that passes through a
certain region to be become tinted with the color of the light. This
region is a cone or tube is defined by the area the light is passing
through.

We can make this volume tint rays that pass through it, which is a
decent approximation to the effect we're looking for (which is caused
by the bright light scattering off of air, dust, or water droplets).
Just make a solid tube or cone of the size and shape you want the
visible light volume to be. Just scaling a normal primative tube is
usually fine. Color it white or yellow (whatever shade the light is)
and position it in your scene starting where the lightsource is and
pointing in the right direction.

You can change how visible the light beam is by setting the "fog
length" parameter, which controls absorbtion in the volume you've
defined. The longer the "fog length," the less dense the fog (or
absorbtion, or tinting, depending on how you look at it.)  As a good
starting place, make the fog length equal to twice the width of the
"beam" as measured in Stage editor Imagine Units. Quickrender... you
should see a noticable, but still transparent light beam.  If it's too
dense, increase the fog length. If it's too tenuous, decrease the fog
length.

That's all there is to it! It's pretty fast and easy to do.

There are two problems with visible light volumes. First, there is no
shadowing. Since it's just a solid object, something that intersects
the beam won't "stop" the light after it passes through. Also, the fog
density is constant, so the intensity of the "visible light" does not
decrease with distance.  You might want to add a linear texture to
make a nice color gradient to partially emulate the intensity dropoff.
Not perfect, but not bad.

Hope this helps!

-Steve

---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Steve Worley                                        [e-mail]
---------------------------------------------------------------------------

##

Subject: Connecting paths
Date: Wed, 05 Feb 92 19:32:17 EST
From: [e-mail]

---
Im have along animation in the making.. but i have a question i have
never done much with paths.. i have 10 megs of ram.. so i can only
have a limited acount of frames with is plentiful but i want to
splice my animations together to make a 5 min one or so.. anyway..
 i have a path (path.1) wich the camera follows for the first 200
frames then the path ends.. How do i get path.2 to take off were the
other path ended? i have tried aliging them up but i have
had no success :( is thier another way?
---

You could eye it, but as you said, that's not necessarily easy.

One slick way would be to design the paths in the Detail editor using
axes, then finally using "make open path" to make the paths. Why?
Well, what you want to do is make two paths which share one end. This
end should be in the same position in both paths, AND have the same
alignment (so they face in the same direction.) If you use axes to
specify the path's key points, you can copy the last axis in path.1 and
use it as the first axis in path.2. It's the same axis, so you'll be
sure they line up perfectly. You could then further edit the paths in
the Stage editor as long as you were careful not to move the ending
control point of path.1 or beginning control point of path.2.

In your animation, make sure that the speed of the object at the end
of the first path is the same as the speed at the beginning of the
second path (use the Action editor to set speed along the path..) If
you don't do this, you might see the speed change very abruptly when
the transition occurs.

Hope this helps.

-Steve

---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Steve Worley                                        [e-mail]
---------------------------------------------------------------------------

##

Subject: Upgrade offer duration...
Date: Wed, 5 Feb 92 18:44:31 -0800
From: [e-mail] (Edward Chadez)

Does anyone know the duragion of the "upgrade to Imagine 2.0" offer??

One could not assume it would go on forever....

-->Edward Chadez  =Amiga3000=
   Computer Animation(DCTV)/Pixel Pusher and
   Intuition Programmer.

--
  //                                                               ()__()
\X/   [e-mail]/Edward Chadez     CARL Systems(303)758-3030       (  )
      [e-mail]                                               MM

##

Subject: Name
Date: Wed, 5 Feb 92 23:44:29 -0500
From: [e-mail] (Elizabeth E Sack)

First of all, thank you to all of the people who responded to my posting about
fog.  Now for the interesting thing,

    Elizabeth Sacke = Jeff Hanna

Elizabeth lets me use her account here at Purdue, since Engineers(like Elizabeth
get them and Technical Graphics students don't :(

So, please refer to me as Jeff.

Thank you.

P.S.  Elizabeth is actually my BROTHER.  Figure it out.


Jeff Hanna
Studio J Video Productions

I raytraced my .SIG, but I forgot to include a lightsource ;)

##

Subject: backdrop and anim building
Date:  5 Feb 92 23:53 -0800
From: Andrew Niemann <[e-mail]>

1)  Just got my copy of Imagine 2.0 and am trying out the backdrop feature.
I seem to have a problem scanline rendering a transparent object over
top of the backdrop. It just comes out skycolor. I put it over top of a
second object to see if I had just made a silly mistake, but the
second object shows through properly.
So I guess that the renderer doesn't see the backdrop behind the
transparent object.-?   Makes it hard to fade objects in and out.

2)  Is there a way to view or contuinue building Imagine anims that were
stopped in mid rendering?  ie. You 'make movie' for say 50 frames. You
do not save rendered pictures to save space on disk. Power goes out at
frame 30.  Is there a way to continue building the rest of the anim?
Or at least have a look at what has been done so far? Maybe change the
appropriate bytes in the script file - which ones denote the length of
the anim?

thanks for any info
andy

##

Subject: Re: Font Objects
Date: Thu, 6 Feb 92 2:03:20 PDT
From: [e-mail] (Aaron Tucker)

> >Other than that, I've discovered that creating font objects, and then
> >sweeping them into unusual shapes is a GREAT way to use up memory.
> >
> >dave
>
> Hey, I run out of memory doing routine things and I have 7 MB...
> Marc Rifkin- Graphics and Multimedia / [e-mail]
>
One thing you might try is to make your faced text, but keep a copy of the
outline. Now, extrude your outline to your hearts desire, then group or
join the faced object with your extruded outline. Don't really know if
it makes a difference, but it is worth a try.

Juan Trevino
[e-mail]
"Wake up. Time to die."  -Leon from BladeRunner

##

Subject: Re: Font Objects
Date: Thu, 6 Feb 92 1:57:58 PDT
From: [e-mail] (Aaron Tucker)

>
> > >Has anybody tried to make large (> 100 points) font objects?
>
  Mark Thompson writes:

> I highly reccomend you use Pixel 3D for this task. It is far more capable
> than Imagine in this respect. And the bigger the 2D image, the better the
> 3D object. I have had no trouble feeding it 2400x600 images for conversion.
>
You can always use a smaller font, convert, scale it up, and clean it up
before you add faces to it. This is a tedious alternative, but produces
very clean results and you have total control over the number of points
and faces from the beginning instead of mucking with output of another
program.

To generate a very large quality bitmap of text, I use Pagestream. You can
get many PD fonts from FTP sites and the Soft-Logik BBS for variety or you
can use the MAC Font Conversion software to convert hundreds of MAC fonts
over. You then reduce your page size to fit your text, and select the
IFF ILBM Printer Driver. Hit print at 300dpi, select a filename, and you
have yourself a large font bitmap. I then use PIXEL 3D.

If you have a DTP program with CGFonts, but don't have IFF output, scale the
letters you need as large as possible in your screen, then grab the screen
with Grabibt, ScreenX, or some such program. I have never done this, but it
should work. Then load the image into DPAINT or any other paint program,
and edit out what you don't want.

Glenn Lewis has a Shareware program that will convert TeX and LaTex fonts
to some type of Amiga font format. There are many FTP sites with TeX and
LaTex fonts. Contact him via EMAIL for more information...for I don't
know ANYTHING about TeX, LaTeX, or Glenn's software, yet. Sorry, I don't
have his EMAIL address handy. :-)

The Masterpiece Font Collection has 100 bitmap fonts that range from 60pts
to 160 pts, averaging at about 120 pts for most. These are great for
loading into DPAINT, IMAGINE, PIXEL 3D, or any program that needs large
fonts. They are very clean, and the manual shows every character of every
font in the collection. There are also some Colorfonts and ClipArt included.

Byte-by-Byte has several fonts for sale for the Sculpt Animate series of
rendering software. You could get those and use Interchange or Pixel 3D
to convert to Imagine format.

The last, but least recommended step, is to use your painting software to
create the largest fonts possible, then scale them up in TAD, ADPRO, IP,
or RasterLink. I think that TAD and ADPRO will provide better results
however because of the methods they use.

Hope this helps anybody with font problems and gives some new avenues of
font conversion to the experienced users.

Juan Trevino
[e-mail]
"Wake up. Time to die."  -Leon from BladeRunner

##

Date:     Thu, 6 Feb 1992 11:53:09 -0500
From: Yee Tom <[e-mail]>

Hi there everyone...

Now that there's direct support for DCTV in Imagine 2.0 and after reading a
recent article in AmigaWorld about its ability to play back
almost 24-bit quality anims in real time, I have begun to consider
purchasing one.  For those of you out there who already have both
Imagine and DCTV, could you please direct your wisdom my way? I'd
like to know:

1. How good is the quality of DCTV animations when you dump them
   to videotape?  Would they impress most everyday joes who
   couldn't tell the difference between true 24-bit and
   approximated 24-bit?  I'd like to create a short sci-fi movie
   if that's the case... or maybe my own commercial as a gag for
   some of my friends.

2. How does the new DCTV software upgrade differ from the paint
   program provided with DCTV?  How much is the upgrade or are
   they now starting to bundle the upgrade with new shipments
   of DCTV?

3. Are there any good reasons why I shouldn't buy DCTV?  I'm
   not concerned with it's slow 10second scan as I have a
   Video Toaster (and the framegrabber) to grab and save IFF24
   which I've been told I can load into DCTV software and
   convert to DCTV format.

4. For those who have tried it, is DCTV truly truly better than
   just rendering in 320x400 HAM?  How long does it take to
   render DCTV frames - i.e. to render DCTV is like rendering
   in which standard Amiga video mode?

Thanks in advance to anyone out there who can tell me something.

##

Subject: DCTV
Date: Thu, 6 Feb 92 14:04:33 -0500
From: [e-mail] (ESTES,JON-PAUL)

Well, I have had DCTV for little over a month now and I love it.
The quality is vastly superior to HAM in any resolution.  The ability
to run this quality of animation at the frame rates possible with DCTV
is well worth the money.  The video tapes made with DCTV have impressed
many of my friends who are "average joes".  Also, if you have the toaster,
this will let you run your Lightwave animations.  As far as the speed for
rendering goes, I have not really compared it to anything else.  Hope this
helps a little.

Jon-Paul

##

Subject: Re: backdrop and anim building
Date: Thu, 6 Feb 92 16:33:55 EST
From: [e-mail] (John J Humpal)

>
> >
> >So I guess that the renderer doesn't see the backdrop behind the
> >transparent object.-?   Makes it hard to fade objects in and out.
> >
>
>     Remember that scanline only approximates transparency, perhaps
> raytracing the scene would help.
>
    Actually, even raytracing won't help.  Transparent objects will
not show backdrop pictures or starfields created in the Action editor's
Globals channel.  Doesn't matter if you're tracing or scanlining.

-John

John J. Humpal -- [e-mail] -- short .sig, std. disclaimer

##

Subject: Re: backdrop and anim building
Date: Thu, 06 Feb 92 14:37:53 EST
From: Mark Thompson <[e-mail]>

Michael Comet writes:
> >I seem to have a problem scanline rendering a transparent object over
> >top of the backdrop. It just comes out skycolor.

>     Remember that scanline only approximates transparency, perhaps
> raytracing the scene would help.

Actually the methods for calculating transparency in a scanline renderer
are generally not very different from those used in ray-tracing, its
just done in such a way that refraction would be very difficult. They
should both produce the same basic results (neglecting refraction). If
they do not, it is either a program bug or user error. But from the symptoms
described, it sounds like a bug. I figure that the code realizes it is
rendering over background and rather than addressing the appropriate pixel
in the background image, it is simply plugging in the assigned backgound
color into the blending equation (likely a coding oversite).
|~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~|
|      `       '        Mark Thompson                 CONCURRENT COMPUTER  |
| --==* RADIANT *==--   [e-mail]        Principal Graphics   |
|      ' Image `        ...!uunet!masscomp!mark       Hardware Architect   |
|     Productions       [phone] [phone]   & General Nuisance   |
|                                                                          |
 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

##

Subject: tablet drivers
Date: Thu, 6 Feb 92 17:18:35 EST
From: [e-mail] (Alan Price)

Howdy. Can anyone lead me to a source (ftp site, etc.) where I can find
drivers for drawing tablets? I have access to several different model
tablets, but they were all bought to use with MSDOS machines. Most of them
sit around unused, as you might guess, and I want to plug one in to my Amiga.

It's relation to Imagine, you ask? I thought I might try 'digitizing' in points
for object designs from drawings or cross-sections of models. Also, this list
is where the gurus hang.

Any info greatly appreciated!
AP.